235: Bootstrapping a $100M Supplement Brand with Matt Gallant

Today I’m talking to Matt Gallant, co-founder of BioOptimizers, a supplement company generating $10M a month with a larger mission to help people live healthier for longer.

Matt started with a simple realization: if he could get great at marketing, he could build a business in almost any category. That belief eventually led him into health, supplements, and BioOptimizers—but not without some hard-earned lessons along the way.

We talk about the moment the business nearly fell apart, how Matt thinks about creating maximum customer value, timeless marketing principles, and the question he believes every entrepreneur needs to ask as markets get more crowded and customers become harder to win.

Mic Drop Moments

• “If I become great at marketing, I could build a business in any category.” – Matt Gallant

• “Culture changes, but human nature doesn’t.” – Matt Gallant

• “The more expensive the product, the more copy you need.” – Matt Gallant

• “If you’re a visionary, you need integrators; if you’re an integrator, you need visionaries.” – Matt Gallant

• “The ultimate edge is knowing the market better than anyone else.” – Matt Gallant

• From $100 to $10M/Month
• The Copywriting Breakthrough
• Timeless Marketing Principles
• Long Copy Vs. Short Copy
• Why Timing Beats Product
• How To Fix Poor Sleep
• BioOptimizers’ Early Origin Story
• When The Business Almost Died
• Creating Maximum Customer Value
• Why Hyper-Relevance Wins
• Competing In A Crowded Market
• The Cost Of Product Complexity
• Minimum Lovable Product
• Meeting Customers Where they Are
• Advice to New Entrepreneurs

Brad Weimert: Matt Gallant, thanks so much for coming.

Matt Gallant: Yeah, super excited to be here.

Brad Weimert: So, I’ve watched you grow BiOptimizers for many years. And to date, you are on a 100 million a year run rate. You’re 95% remote, and you’ve got this ostentatious mission of increasing lifespan to 100, average age of 100.

Matt Gallant: Around the planet.

Brad Weimert: Around the planet.

Matt Gallant: Which is ambitious.

Brad Weimert: Which is awesome. I want to talk about everything from the growth of the business to supplements and optimizing stuff for entrepreneurs and humanity. But I want to start with bootstrapping the company with $100 in your pocket to now 10 million a month. What was the first plateau you hit, and what was the last plateau you just had to overcome in your growth path?

Matt Gallant: Yeah. Well, I guess let’s start from the beginning. I started making money online in 2002. Prior to that, I was really obsessed with copywriting. So, for, like, three, four years, all the money I was making from my personal training business, I was spending on courses, seminars, mentors, books, and…

Brad Weimert: For frame, how old were you?

Matt Gallant: I got obsessed with copywriting probably at 21, 22.

Brad Weimert: Okay.

Matt Gallant: Yeah. There was a eureka moment. I still, like, remember that moment. I was in bed, and it hit me, like, “Okay, if I become great at marketing, I could build a business in any category,” which I still think is true. And then the second realization was, okay, well, copywriting is the core of that. As a teenager, I was always buying stuff through direct mail, so I’d receive a lot of direct mail pieces, and I was always fascinated by the copy. And being a buyer from these marketing materials, I realized that these are powerful, you know? And there are some fun full circle stories in that, but anyways, got obsessed with copywriting, started studying internet marketing. Back then, Ken McCarthy was a big teacher.

Brad Weimert: Was he JV Alert?

Matt Gallant: Corey Rudl, you know, passed away. So, there were some early OGs, Jonathan Mizel, who’s still active. So, anyways, those were kind of the early OGs teaching stuff. But the best event ever for me at that time was John Reese’s Traffic Secrets, which I went to live. And John was, like, several steps ahead of anyone teaching. It was just like a mind-blowing event. And if you implemented what he was teaching back then, it’s hard not to make money.

Brad Weimert: Well, let me ask you something with the copywriting stuff right now. So, you dropped a bunch of names that I know because we grew up in the same era in business. I was doing sales at the time. And I had a very similar mental light bulb, which was I knew that sales was at the core of certainly face-to-face, but to get people there required marketing, which I didn’t know. And so, I had this very distinct moment also where I was like, “Oh, sh*t, if I can learn marketing, I can do this in any business.” And I thought that about sales until I realized you have to get people there. Right? And I don’t want to knock on doors all the time. But I wanted to talk about copywriting because all of those people, if you’re an entrepreneur today, do you go study them, or do you look for somebody that’s teaching it now?

Matt Gallant: One of the elements I love about marketing is that the first principles are timeless. If you think about human nature, it doesn’t really change. Like, our nervous system’s the same, our brains are more or less the same. Culture changes, but human nature doesn’t. So, you can go back and read Claude Hopkins’ Scientific Advertising and learn a lot. I mean, that’s over 100-plus years old. I mean, it’s a great book. All the stuff from John Caples, Ogilvy, these are just timeless books. But yeah, guys like John Carlton, Ted Nicholas, Dan Kennedy, Gary Halbert, which has a massive amount of information for free. I think it’s thegaryhalbertletter.com. Gary Bencivenga, Clayton Makepeace. I haven’t seen anybody teaching copy in the last five, ten years that’s better than those guys.

I haven’t seen it. And we could talk about kind of how copy’s evolved, because I’ve done probably about 22,000 A/B split tests. We’re constantly testing everything we can, which then kind of reveals how things are changing. Like, one of the things that has changed is back in the early 2000s, the rule of thumb was ugly works. You know, F design. You don’t need design, you don’t need branding, you don’t need imagery, just pure copy.

Brad Weimert: Yep.

Matt Gallant: And then I’d say in the 2010s, or so, it shifted. Design started becoming a big deal, and now it’s as big a deal as ever, if not the biggest deal ever. And I think we’ve seen the fusion of effective copy, but kind of it’s got to be punchy, and less is more for the most part, because we do know attention spans have been reduced, right? They’re shorter. So, that is one thing that has changed. So, we’re finding that less copy works better. Great design and branding is crucial. Like, you need both.

Brad Weimert: That’s really good to hear now. I think that my perception of that is that today, there’s so much produced that there’s a credibility consideration around design that’s necessary, and it’s how you look like you have this massive professional brand. And in the eras that you’re talking about, everybody was still figuring it out, right? And there’s some confusion with me around long form, short form, because you still see examples of tremendous long form that works, which is bizarre to me, because I don’t read sh*t. Like, somebody does a 300-word Facebook post, and I’m like I get two sentences in or four, and I’m like, “Okay, we’re moving on.” Do you have any idea of when long form works and when short form is the key?

Matt Gallant: Yeah. Again, having done that many tests, and just to give you an example of how granular we get with testing, we’ll run the same experiment on different types of traffic. So, that’s what revealed the answer because one of the longest debated topics in copy is how much copy should you write? And no one really had a great answer, but I think I’m going to give the best answer most people have never heard, which is the first rule is the more expensive the product, the more copy you need. If I’m selling a pack of bubble gum, I need like one or two sentences, right? Sugar-free, it’s four milligrams of nicotine, whatever the product is about. If I’m selling a $10,000 mattress or a $10,000 course or a live experience, you need way more copy because it’s a bigger decision, right? It’s not going to be an impulsive decision to just drop 10K.

Brad Weimert: Is that fundamentally the idea, is that you’re handling many more objections to the process?

Matt Gallant: Yeah, of course, somebody’s going to be way more protective of $10,000 versus a dollar. The second variable is, how new is that product? Like, is it a new type of product? If somebody’s familiar with magnesium, which is one of our bestselling products, they don’t need as much copy as if we’re coming out with a product that has 17 Chinese herbs they’ve never heard of. So, the hardest thing in marketing is really teaching people. So, one of the mistakes I’ve made, kind of being a futurist where I can kind of see where things are going and I try to stay on the bleeding edge by being connected to a lot of cutting-edge people, timing is the biggest variable in success.

There was a huge analysis they did on 150 startups. They looked at funding, team, product, but they found that timing was the thing. And I’ve made the mistake many times of launching a product, like, three, five, seven years too early because the market wasn’t educated. So, the amount of money you got to spend or the effectiveness of your marketing when you’re coming out with something the world’s never seen, it’s hard. It’s really hard. So, that’s the second variable. And then hot/cold is the last one. So, what we found is, obviously, if we go to cold traffic, new people, they need more copy than if it’s a repeat customer. And that’s probably the biggest one and easiest one.

So, like, on our e-com site, which is the main site, almost anything we try to add to the pages reduces conversions. Like, less is more. Versus if it’s an affiliate page or an influencer, that’s like lukewarm, so we can put a little bit more, and it’ll improve conversions. But if it’s absolutely cold traffic, yeah, we need a bit more copy. That’s where kind of the long-form, direct-response style shines.

Brad Weimert: Yeah, that tracks. Well, I want to get into your product set eventually, but I also want, later, I want to talk about kind of how the product set influences people, impacts people, etcetera. But as a quick takeaway, for an entrepreneur or an individual that’s trying to optimize performance, what is your single biggest go-to?

Matt Gallant: Hard not to say sleep. You know?

Brad Weimert: Yes. Sleep’s a slippery bitch, man.

Matt Gallant: And it’s not necessarily, like, quantity. Quantity matters, but it’s really the quality. Like, I got obsessed with sleep when I started tracking my sleep, like, 12 years ago. There was a Zeo. It was a headband, like this is way before Oura. And I was getting, like, 0 to 15 minutes of deep sleep. So, I was sleeping eight, nine hours and feeling like trash in the morning.

Brad Weimert: Yeah. I’m familiar with that feeling.

Matt Gallant: Yeah, it’s not a good feeling, and kind of everything gets harder, versus if you sleep a good night’s sleep, everything gets easier. You kind of perform at your best.

Brad Weimert: Is the key to sleep, there are, like… And I’m way down the…

Matt Gallant: I could, like, rapid-fire all the best stuff.

Brad Weimert: Perfect. Well, so, what I was going to ask you is I’m clear on the best stuff. I want you to rapid-fire that, but is it more important to moderate caffeine, to take a supplement, or to deal with, like, light regulation before you go to bed? What’s the one thing?

Matt Gallant: I’m going to rapid-fire all of it.

Brad Weimert: Beautiful.

Matt Gallant: All right, here we go. Let’s kind of go through a 24-hour cycle.

Brad Weimert: Okay.

Matt Gallant: Probably the best way to frame it. Wake up in the morning. Optimally, you’re getting that sunlight in your eyes first 20, 30 minutes. That makes a big difference. That basically kickstarts your circadian rhythm. If you’re living in brutally cold climates, like I was born and raised in Canada, you can get 10,000 lux lights that accomplish the same thing. So, you don’t need to necessarily go outside, but you want to get the lumens in your eyeballs. That’s one. Two, if you’re a slow caffeine metabolizer, which if you do some genetic tests you can find out, you want to cut caffeine around 1:00 or 2:00. I’m a slow caffeine metabolizer, so if I actually made the mistake my first day in Austin, I’m in Austin right now, I drank a cold brew at, like, 3:00 PM, and I’m there lying in bed like, “Damn,” like it was not a good night’s sleep.

Brad Weimert: At what time?

Matt Gallant: No, I went to bed at, like, 12:00, but I probably fell asleep at 2:00.

Brad Weimert: Yeah. Okay. I wanted to set the frame because I go to bed at, like, 9:00, right? Or 9:30.

Matt Gallant: PM.

Brad Weimert: PM. Yeah, usually. But the half-life of caffeine is, like, do you know?

Matt Gallant: Again, that’s where the genetics matter. If you’re a slow caffeine metabolizer, the half-life is way longer. So, that’s a big deal. And all stimulants matter. I mean, nicotine, which I think you’re a fan, I’m a fan, has a very short half-life. It’s 30 minutes. So, depending how much you’ve ingested, you can probably cut off, like, an hour or two before bed and have a minimal impact.

Brad Weimert: Again, depending on…

Matt Gallant: How much.

Brad Weimert: How much and how you metabolize.

Matt Gallant: Yeah. Some people… But again, it’s fast typically. So, let’s talk about, like, the last four, five hours before bed. Like, that’s the real critical window. First one is food. So, obviously, if your stomach is full when you go to bed, that’s going to impact you, which one of our products is still our second-best-selling product. It’s called MassZymes, and it breaks down food better than any other product. It has 18 enzymes, and you’re basically just incinerating the food. The protease will break down the protein, the lipase break down the fats, the amylase break down the carbs and some other enzymes. And for years, we would get reports of people saying, like, “Wow, I’m getting better sleep.”

And it took a while to figure out, okay, it’s because it’s clearing out the food, like it’s breaking it down, so they’re not going to bed with their stomach full and their intestinal tract loaded with food. So, anyways, that’s a big deal. And three hours, two hours before bed, I mean, that’s when you want to start controlling light. Now, you can wear blue light-blocking glasses. I dim all the lights. If you’ve got smart light bulbs, you can make them go red. So, you got a few options, and some people are way more sensitive to blue light than others. I’m one of them. So, if there’s a light like in a room like this, I will not get sleepy. I can stay up pretty much all night just because the lights stimulate me that much.

Brad Weimert: Oh, crazy.

Matt Gallant: So, there is some individual differences there. And optimally, and I’d admit, it’s probably, like, the last thing I’m not doing, but cutting off internet about an hour before bed would be ideal. Like, I know that. I’m just not doing it. I’ll be in my bed doing a quick 5, 10-minute TikTok scroll, trying to find something funny. But it’s more the dopamine. It’s not just the blue light. The dopamine that you get from being online is impactful. Magnesium or your whole sleep stack about an hour before is optimal. So, Magnesium Breakthrough is our bestseller. Sleep Breakthrough is another good one. Again, different molecules. But you want to basically prime your body to produce more melatonin.

So, magnesium is a precursor, and it’s very effective to basically calm your nervous system down, boost GABA, melatonin, etcetera. I got to clean my nose here. Sorry. My daughter was sick like 10 days ago. She sneezed right to my face. I’m like, “Oh, man.” I’m at the tail end of it, but still.

Brad Weimert: Okay. So, you did exactly what all entrepreneurs are never going to follow, which is you gave the whole routine of how do you optimize sleep. If you have to pick one of those things, which one is it?

Matt Gallant: I’m a fan, and of course, I’m biased, but I’m a fan of using tools that counteract bad habits, and that’s where kind of supplements can come in. So, for a long time, like, one of the things I didn’t cover, which I finally kind of locked in, is going to bed at the same time. Like, I was all over the place for a long, long time, for most of my life. In the last year or so, I finally, like within a 20, 30-minute range, I’m going to bed, and that makes such a huge difference, like one of the biggest ones, I’d say. But if you take a good supplement stack for bed, you can counteract a lot of those issues.

Brad Weimert: Outside of magnesium, so you ta-

Matt Gallant: L-theanine, PharmaGABA. So, for some people, about 85% of people, GABA works really well. GABA calms the brain down. And there’s a lot of sources of GABA, like there’s just normal GABA, PharmaGABA, which is from Mitsubishi. There’s valerian root. There’s skull cap. So, they’re all kind of hitting those receptors. We love PharmaGABA. It seems to be a little bit more potent. Glycine is amazing. Like, 3 grams is a good sleep dose. But looking at the research, like, almost everybody’s deficient in glycine compared to where we should be. Should be about 10 to 15 grams a day. It’s a very cheap amino acid. You can go to any supplement store and pick it up. But for sleep, like 3 to 5 grams.

It lowers your body temp. And the next day, and here’s a great topic, back to how do we counteract bad sleep. All right. First one is glycine. They’ve done the research and shown that if you, let’s say, don’t have a good night’s sleep and you took glycine, you’ll feel much better and perform better the next day. The new one that’s hitting the circuit, so to speak, is creatine. Like, if you do that 15 to 28 gram dose after a night of bad sleep, you can basically perform at par. And I’ve tested it. I mean, it is very effective, like basically five scoops and you’re like, “Oh, wow.”

Brad Weimert: Yeah. And, for frame, you said five scoops just now, which is helpful. But for frame…

Matt Gallant: It’s like 5 grams per scoop, so.

Brad Weimert: Got it. Yeah. Exactly. So, historically, creatine was used for or promoted for muscle growth and specifically to lifters, right?

Matt Gallant: Yeah.

Brad Weimert: And so, it seems like in the last year or so, I’ve seen it be promoted much more heavily for cognition, but at a significantly higher dose.

Matt Gallant: Yeah. And that’s a thing. If you’re deep into biohacking, there’s a lot of stuff that is dose dependent that, like on the labels, one of the things we need to deal with as supplement companies is what we can put on the label. And we can only put one thing. I can’t put a protocol on a bottle. I can’t say, “Okay, take 5 grams if you want to build muscle. Take 25 if you want to counter a bad night’s sleep.” You can’t do that legally. So, that’s where you have to kind of connect with or listen to people that are pushing the envelope, but yeah, with a lot of molecules. I mean, psilocybin’s a great example where if you take a small amount, it’s going to have a certain effect.

If you take a very large amount, it’s a completely different experience, where alcohol’s the same thing. Drink one beer, it’s going to probably just chill you out a little bit, but drink 20 ounces of whiskey, it’s a different experience.

Brad Weimert: Yeah. I can attest to that.

Matt Gallant: So, a lot of stuff’s dose-dependent both on the negative side and on the positive side, and creatine seems to be one of those that, yeah, if you push the dose, like when we do Metamorphosis, which is our brain training intensive, which we can talk about later, we push the dose on a lot of things very high.

Brad Weimert: What are popular sleep protocols or supplements that you’re like, “Absolutely do not do that,” or there’s tremendous detrimental effect to it?

Matt Gallant: Well, Bryan Johnson, who’s become well-known the last couple of years, he has come to all the conclusions that I came to, which is, again, all the stuff we covered, the food. One of the things that he’s brought to the surface, which I wasn’t tracking, and still, I’m not tracking, is the number one thing he looks for is resting heart rate before he hits the sack. He says, like, that metric is the metric, which, going back to food, like eating too much, that raises your heart rate. Caffeine too late raises your heart rate. Too much nicotine too late raises your heart rate. So, I think it’s a really good metric to lock in on and try to optimize.

But, yeah, there’s not much I’m hearing that’s really bad. Of course, like pitch black room should be a thing. Super cold. I’ll shout out Essentia. To me, it’s my favorite mattress. The Eight Sleep, amazing. Best cooling pad out there. Just I love their pad. I’ve tried other ones, and I think theirs is the best. So, again, to summarize, if we just, like, rapid fire here. Wake up, light in the morning, don’t eat four hours before bed, ideally five maybe. Take your sleep stack about an hour before bed. Control light maybe an hour, two hours before bed. Try to go to bed at the same time. Blackout room, super cold room, good memory foam mattress, Essentia, Eight Sleep to cool, especially if you’re running hot, and I think that covers most of it.

Brad Weimert: All right. I want to get back to longevity in a second, but let’s go into the actual business building as it pertains to supplements. Go ahead.

Matt Gallant: Well, yeah, we kind of went on the copywriting tangent and the sleep tangent. Let me go back to the very beginning because it is, I think, a good story.

Brad Weimert: Copywriting?

Matt Gallant: Yeah. So, let’s go to, like, the first moment I started making money. So, John Carlton was my mentor, and I was, like, sending him copy every day. And I had a personal training client that owned a white-labeling skincare business, like a high-end white-labeling skincare business, in Scottsdale. And she kind of saw the potential in me, so she’s like, “Hey, I want to build you a product, and I want you to market it.” And that was my first successful product. It’s called the Anti-Aging Super Serum. And John was brutal. When he’d send you feedback, there was no pulled punches. But then one time he’s like, “Dude, like, this is really, really good.” And that gave me the confidence to launch. And I was doubling my money every day.

So, going on AdWords, like, I was on Overture. Like, that’s Yahoo’s pay-per-click before AdWords. That’s how early I was on pay-per-click and became pretty good at pay-per-click. So, I was just bidding on keywords, and I’m doubling my money every day. And then sort of selling information, guitar courses was where I started. Guitar Control is the name of the biz. Still alive. It’s on life support. YouTube killed us because we were selling DVDs back then.

Brad Weimert: Oh, sh*t. Yeah.

Matt Gallant: I mean, at the peak, we had, like, 85 courses and getting into that business. But BiOptimizer started in 2004, and my partner, Wade, he was winning national natural bodybuilding championships as a vegetarian. Now, this is like 22 years ago, before plant-based was a thing. And I just like, I said, “Dude, I think it’s weird enough that we can make this work.” Like, plant-based guy, natural. Like, it was just ticking a lot of weird boxes. And he didn’t even own a computer, and I said, “Hey, I’m making money online.” So, we worked together. We created an info product, a book called Freaky Big Naturally and launched it. And again, we were just like, the ROAS was insane. I mean, back then, there wasn’t that much competition, so it was a lot easier.

And anyways, we were doubling our money every day. We made our first million in gross revenue in the first 18 months, and then we decided to launch our first supplement, which was MassZymes. And back then, that was the first big protein wave. Like, if you bought a bodybuilding magazine and you flipped through it, probably a third of it was protein ads, like protein was really the first wave of explosion. And it just kind of hit me. And we can get into product creation, which is something I’m still chief product officer and very passionate about. I was thinking, well, okay, if you’re ingesting protein, that’s not what you want. You want the amino acids, so you need the enzymes to break that down, and no one had really built an enzyme formula for protein.

And that’s what we did, and man, we were… Here’s a very unusual product creation philosophy. We went to the formulators, and we said, “Hey, we want the best thing ever. We don’t care how much it costs.” So, they’re like, “Okay.” They build it. They come back to us. They say, “$27 a bottle is the cost.” To put things in perspective, like the average cost of a supplement, and ours is a lot higher than this, is around $2 to $5. So, we were five, eight, nine times that. And I’m like, “You know what? We’ll figure out how to sell it.” So, we priced it at $150, which is very high for a supplement.

Brad Weimert: And this is what year?

Matt Gallant: That was in ’05.

Brad Weimert: Yeah, for frame of reference, $150 for a supplement today is very high.

Matt Gallant: I can’t recall seeing that. Like, I’m trying to think like, have I seen 150? I don’t. I haven’t seen that in a long, long, long time. I don’t know if I’ve seen it since MassZymes. But it was a big bottle. What was crazy is like we had bodybuilders buying three a month. There was Michael Lovitch. If you ever talk to Michael Lovitch, bring this topic up, because every time he sees me, he’s like, “Dude, I still can’t believe you did that.” It blew his mind.

Brad Weimert: Lovitch, for reference, is a crazy person, but a really creative, interesting marketer.

Matt Gallant: Yeah. He’s always been very successful and…

Brad Weimert: And I say that in the best way possible. I mean, he’s a wild man.

Matt Gallant: He’s a wild man and a creative machine. Anyways, so we launched that, and that was incredibly successful. There’s a longer story we can get into if you want.

Brad Weimert: Well, what I heard so far is like launch success, launch success, launch success. And the question was…

Matt Gallant: Which then, there was a massive period of spiraling descent into a coma that lasted many years. So, we can get into that if you think that’s interesting.

Brad Weimert: Well, what I want to hit on is, I mean, dude, I know when I was talking to Jesse Elder last night, who’s also been on the show and a great friend of both of ours, he said, “You know, what’s interesting about Matt is that he’s sort of this polymath. Like, he’s very good at all these different things. One of them is that he’s a musician.” And he was like, “I don’t know how public he is about that, but I know that it’s been a big part of his life.” So, I think there’s a lot of cool stories that I want to hit on, but I want to follow the business through line because the opening question was, what were the plateaus, right? So, you’ve got great success. Where did you get stuck, and how did you get through it?

And before we started, you were talking about those, how you operate being fundamentally different at different stages of business. And so, it’s really perpetually interesting to me to look at the early plateaus and the later plateaus, and how they’re handled differently, and what the problems are.

Matt Gallant: I’m laughing because it wasn’t a plateau. It was flying off a cliff. So, I need to get a bit personal to give context. I got divorced at 28. So, anyways, back to BiOptimizers. All of this happened kind of in different timelines or simultaneously, but got divorced, got introduced to MDMA.

Brad Weimert: Fun.

Matt Gallant: Well, and I got introduced to MDMA, then I got divorced. That was really like the kickstart. It was like, “Wow, okay. This is a new world.” And you know, things weren’t good with my marriage, and I wasn’t happy. Got married young, and we weren’t really compatible. And went off the rails, like went off the rails with drugs and alcohol from pretty much 28 to 32. And then BiOptimizers started right around that time. And back to the framework, have you heard the 1/3/10 framework?

Brad Weimert: In terms of revenue?

Matt Gallant: Yeah. And so, you start off, let’s see, your first 100K, 300K, a million, 3 million, 10 million, 30 million, 100 million, 300 million, a billion. At every one of those stages, the game changes, right? And you have to keep evolving in order to maintain or continue the growth. So, back to the first plateau, we were at around 3 million. It just purely off the effectiveness of the copy and the products. I didn’t care about operations. I didn’t care about customer support. Like, I was not an entrepreneur. I was a three-trick pony. I was good at writing copy, creating products, and pay-per-click. That was it. And literally, like, I didn’t care about, like, again, the everything else that you needed to be good at to be a good entrepreneur. So, everything fell apart.

It started with Wade telling his girlfriend, who was kind of our ops manager, to quit because I was on a 10-day bender in Montreal, and he was just sick and tired of hearing her complain about how I was not functional and didn’t care. So, she quit, and then we hired someone else, who we found out later was, like, a crack addict, and she wasn’t doing her work. So, two months later, I get a call from a fulfillment center, and they say, “Hey, dude, are you still in business?” And I’m like, man, that sinking feeling, like, “What?” Like, it was just trying to compute what was just said, and I realized she wasn’t sending the orders. So, we had two months of orders not being shipped. And they were all on subscription. So, guess what happened?

Subscription revenue crashes, 70%, 80%. Took a couple of months. And I made the mistake, I said, “Ship everything overnight.” So, the next month, revenue drops 80%. We get a massive FedEx bill, like every order was a couple of hundred bucks to send. They were just sending like overnight. I remember there was one order that was $234 to ship to some island in the UK. So, yeah, it was brutal. And then Wade and I went to war. Wade was, understandably, sick and tired of me being in the zone that I was in. So, I was at Disney World with my girlfriend at the time, and I remember I got an email from a lawyer basically threatening me, and obviously, that ruined my Disney trip and kickstarted like Wade and I are both intense guys, so we kind of went to war mode.

And he flew back to Panama. I mean, the one thing I think that kept us from like really killing each other and destroying the friendship, there was enough brotherly love that had been built over time that it prevented that. But long story short, the business completely fell apart in about 2007, and we kept it alive. It was making about 100K a year. So, the business is making about 100K a year, and our friendship was basically annihilated. We talk like a couple of times a year. In 2009, I hit rock bottom and decided to stop the lifestyle I was doing and got back on a spiritual path. I was an atheist for a long time. And about like 2011-2012, we started kind of hanging out a little bit, going to spiritual events together. We’d go to Sedona, go see Dr. David Hawkins.

And then in 2012-2013, we started talking and like, “Hey, we should try rebooting all the stuff that we did and see if it works.” So, we did that. It completely failed. Like, the market had evolved way past us, and that’s a great topic. Markets are always evolving. The game is always getting harder. In ’04 on Google AdWords, you could bid on the keyword dog and sell credit card processing. It would work, right? You can’t do that now. So, anyways, decided, “You know what? We’re not passionate about bodybuilding anymore. We’re really passionate about health,” and I was thinking like, “Yeah, how do we explain what we’re passionate about?” I thought biological optimization is really what we’re doing. Let’s shorten that to BiOptimizers.”

And yeah, we also knew, and back to plateaus, my experience of having everything fall apart taught me I needed an integrator. Like, for those of you that are an entrepreneur, if you’ve never read Rocket Fuel, to me, that’s like mandatory reading. The visionary integrator framework is crucial. If you’re a visionary, you need integrators; if you’re an integrator, you need visionaries, is basically the punchline. And we brought in a third partner, a good friend, Dave, and he was a really good operator, integrator. And then we launched.

And yeah, we made a million the first year, like $1.3M, $1.4M, and then our growth rate since has been in the mid-40s, like year average. And yeah, just bootstrapped the whole way. So, anyways, I wanted to cover that because I think longevity and not giving up and just continuing to fight and to figure out how to win makes success inevitable. I think a lot of people stop and quit too early, and if we had done that, we certainly wouldn’t be where we are today.

Brad Weimert: So, you started by saying BIOptimizers started in 2004, but it sounds like some derivative of that was 2004.

Matt Gallant: That’s accurate. Back then, we were MassZymes, Inc.

Brad Weimert: Got it. So, I think that’s a really important distinction because there are kind of fundamental differences between pivoting and starting a new thing. And it sounds like you functionally started a new thing in 2012, 2013.

Matt Gallant: Yeah, the only thing that carried over was MassZymes, the product, which is still our second-best seller.

Brad Weimert: Which is crazy.

Matt Gallant: So, that kept the business alive during those dark years and was kind of the core product that we relaunched with, and again, it’s still a very successful product.

Brad Weimert: Well, let’s go into operating a supplement company in 2026. So, there are a series of different– you’ve got so many different things in this space. You can white label products. You can formulate them yourself. You can go broad. You can get specific. Supplements today is a much more crowded space than it was 20 years ago.

But there are products, like Chris who did Athletic Greens that had one SKU, one product, and just blew up one product. How do you think about driving success with one SKU or one product versus having a variety of products to serve an audience?

Matt Gallant: Yeah, it’s a great question. I’m going to start by answering, to me, the core question, which is I think no matter what market you’re in, the question you got to constantly be obsessed with is, how do I create maximum value? And the answer to that question changes based on what type of product you’re building or selling and who you’re serving, right?

In our space, it’s effectiveness. There’s other things that create value, and this is a good tangent, like form factor matters. And in AG1, again, if we’re to break down why that was valuable to the consumer, it was the efficiency of having all these molecules in one package. So, there is a friction remover. There’s a time-saver. There’s arguably a bit of a money-saving value proposition having all these things in one.

So, you have good job coming up with that. I’m a huge believer that I think the most underutilized value vector is removing friction. I think, as humans, I’m hypersensitive to friction. Like anything that introduces friction, I’m going to do everything it takes, whether it’s time, energy, money to annihilate that out of my life.

Brad Weimert: Yeah, me too.

Matt Gallant: Right?

Brad Weimert: Yeah.

Matt Gallant: So, anything that reduces friction, I will pay a premium for. And again, that was one of the things they did. So, that’s one thing. But our main thing has always been we want to be the best in class. We want to have the most effective product in that category, whatever category that we’re in. And that’s evolved, like how we’ve performed that back in ‘05, it was going to a formulator and say, “Hey, just give me the best.” That was like level one. We didn’t know what we were doing. I understood the basics of biology, and that was it.

And then as we built other products, I started getting way more sophisticated, looking at a lot of research, studying how the body’s pathways work, like we call them bio pathways or neurological pathways. Like, what happens with molecules is you ingest them, and then your body converts them into other stuff. So, if you kind of understand that sequence and you have a target molecule like melatonin, okay, what are the building blocks of melatonin? What can we give the body that’s going to allow it to produce more melatonin? So, that was kind of the approach to Magnesium Breakthrough and Sleep Breakthrough.

And then, in 2019, this is where like, and I’m not just saying this, I am not aware of any other supplement company that does what I’m about to say. In 2019, I went to visit our devs that they’re all at a university in Bosnia and Sarajevo called IBU, International Burch University, and I didn’t know they had a whole biology department. So, I meet the head of the biology department. She has a PhD in probiotics and bacteria. I’m like, “Okay, let’s do business.”

So, we made a deal with the university, where we hire students, we hire some of the staff there. We’ve supplied them with over a million dollars in equipment that the university would never buy. So, the students get a chance to really kind of get some real-world practice on some really cool, like, half-million-dollar HPLC machines, stuff like that.

And I just got the stat yesterday. We aggregated how many experiments we’ve done. It’s over 73,000 experiments we’ve done since 2019. So, for every product, like it’s 18 months to two years of running experiments on testing the raw ingredients, combining the ingredients, trying to just create synergy, and that’s become our top competitive advantage. But that’s not enough.

And something I really want to highlight that you brought up earlier, which is trust. Like, one of the best books on marketing ever is Eugene Schwartz, Breakthrough Advertising, and the best framework in that book is the levels of market sophistication, and he breaks it down into five levels. Like, level one is make a claim, lose weight. Level two is aggrandize the claim, so lose 30 pounds in 30 days. Level three is introduce a mechanism, which is lose 30 pounds in 30 days doing CrossFit. CrossFit’s the mechanism. Level four is now you’re getting, like, the mechanisms become the competition. Like, okay, I’ve got a better mechanism than CrossFit. I’ve got a better diet than whatever diet you’ve been on.

And then the market, over time, gets more and more difficult to sell to, right? They’re getting more sophisticated. Their trust is actually lowering. And then you get to level five, where you have to be incredibly powerful. There’s a lot of level five marketing strategies we can talk about, and I think trust is at the core of it. So, now we’re investing. Like this year, we’re going to invest half a million dollars on a variety of clinical trials because we know we’re the best in the lab because we not only test our stuff, we’ll buy the top 20 products and test them and compare them, but we need to prove it.

And me saying I’m the best, that doesn’t work. You have to have hard evidence and I think a real interesting topic, something I think a lot about is what are all the different types of proof? And that’s a sophisticated question and answer because if you’re 19, okay, seeing your favorite athlete or influencer is enough proof. If you’re a scientist, which is on the other end of the extreme, you need double-blind randomized clinical trials to believe whatever’s being said. So, that’s kind of the range.

So, I think you really need all these different types of proof in order to win in 2026. Like, yeah, influencers works. Getting celebrity endorsements, powerful testimonials, reviews, all of these things matter. But yeah, figuring out kind of what’s the proof stack for your business is a big deal, and yeah, we’re investing a lot of money in that.

Brad Weimert: So, I think what I heard from single product to multi-SKU and growth is that you’re leaning heavily in the direction of single product because the efficacy is so important in the product long-term that trying to go broad with a bunch of stuff is too difficult to do and not effective.

Matt Gallant: I mean, again, I don’t want to throw AG1 under the bus. A lot of people have done that job for me, and I know Chris, I’ve met Chris, I’ve had dinner with Chris. The big complaint against AG1 is the dose is not effective. Like, it’s a great concept, and there’s probably some things in there that have enough of, but the dose matters. We talked about that earlier. A lot of stuff you need a lot more than what’s in there. That’s the real issue.

So, it’s a very difficult thing to do, to do an all-in-one. Like IMA is the newest competitor on the block, and I think they’ve arguably built a better version of an AG1, but even that, it’s very difficult to really create clinical amounts of 80 different molecules in one package. Like, I don’t think it’s doable is the short answer. And I’ve heard AG1 has kind of peaked and is dropping. Anyways, I’ve heard that.

I think, back to what marketing is, like business building 101 is, okay, we have a target market. That’s the foundation of everything. Who are they? What do they value? What’s their frustration? And what can I sell them that they’re willing to pay money for? And then you build the best version of that, and it has to be, again, superior to the alternatives, and then you need to effectively market those differences and those advantages to that group, and that’s where advertising comes in. And that’s the game.

And in health, there’s dozens, if not hundreds, of sub-markets, and I think one really important point is that every market is always niching down into smaller molecules. It’s almost like cells subdividing. If think about fitness, like in the ‘60s, it was just like this broad concept. Then bodybuilding came around, and then aerobics came around, and then now you got CrossFit, and then I heard HYROX yesterday, and then you got spin classes. So, it’s always subdividing because, and this is maybe the greatest North Star anybody can follow, like, this is my obsession today, and it’s hyper-relevance.

Hyper-relevance is the number one thing, I think, every entrepreneur needs to be focused on and obsessed with. And I think in the age of AI, there’s going to be new ways that we can hit levels of hyper-relevance that we’ve never hit before. So, let’s define hyper-relevance. I know you well enough that if I was to craft a sales letter by hand or like a one of one sales letter to Brad, you would have a hard time not reading and probably not buying whatever I’m selling you because I know who you are and I know how you work and I know enough about you. So, that’s really the game.

And I think the problem with being generic or having an all-in-one versus a really targeted product, I’ll give you an example. Like, we’re coming out with a female-focused creatine product. And then it’s not just the packaging. We’re adding other stuff that really helps solve some of the primary female pain points, primarily of perimenopausal women. So, that’s how targeted we’re getting with that formula because it’s our number one market right now.

Because if you need brain surgery, you’re not going to go see a general practitioner. If you’ve got a blown-out knee, you want to find the best guy, the best knee surgeon you possibly can. And that’s just built into our problem-solving brains. We want to find naturally whoever’s the best, whoever’s the real expert at that. I mean, I’m sure you’re the same way when you’re hiring people, whether it’s an agency or an employee. Like, you want to find somebody who’s a real wizard at that role and bring them in. So, it’s the same thing when we’re buying products.

Brad Weimert: Well, I want to pull that out, too, out of supplements to anybody listening because the idea of both niching down and also hyper-relevance, all this applies to any business category that’s out there.

Matt Gallant: A million percent.

Brad Weimert: And so, you’re talking about, down to the molecules or the use cases, which are correlated but different, right, how you market to an individual and then what the individual molecule is when you go downstream. I would challenge anybody to think about their specific business or service and say how broad are you going right now, and how many people does it serve, and can you go down to one avatar, and can you go down to a specific use case for that specific avatar, and say, “Is that a feature of the product?” And how deep can you go with the feature of the product or service?

Matt Gallant: And the thing, like, probably the advice I’ve given the most to up-and-coming entrepreneurs is the ultimate edge is knowing the market better than anyone else. And I think the key– I built businesses in 15 different markets since 2019. And and most of them, I was passionate about it. Like, I was the target market. Guitar Control, I’ve been playing guitar since I’m 12. Health, I’m super passionate. Like, so almost everything I did, I could switch my mindset to the consumer.

And like MassZymes, we basically built for ourselves. Magnesium Breakthrough, we built for ourselves. Like, I was playing around with combining a bunch of magnesiums and I was blown away by the effectiveness and just thought, like, “Okay, we need to build this. We need to sell this.” And we built an even better version of that. So, if you’re really into a market, your ability to write the best copy, create great designs, create great products is very difficult to beat.

Brad Weimert: Yeah, I agree with you, but I think one of the challenges, and this’ll tie into the next question here, one of the challenges is it’s very commonplace advice to say pursue the thing you’re passionate about or solve your own problem, scratch your own itch. Great. Also, where does that coincide with the most effective product in the market? So, you landed on magnesium supplement, super fu*king crowded space, and enzymes. There are tons of those products out there.

For a while, you had a heavy focus on nootropics, which are these cutting-edge, different things you can take to try to amplify your performance, brain focus, energy, etc. Those are really fringe things. And to your point earlier, you have to educate people on those things.

Matt Gallant: Yes. That was a good example of timing. Keep going.

Brad Weimert: Okay, yeah, yeah. So, you can answer this however you will, but you can niche down to an area like that and miss, or you can go niche down to magnesium, which is such a broad thing and so crowded. Why did you pick magnesium and enzymes instead of nootropics? And how does one pick, which of those areas to niche down in, if they’re interested in none of them or all of them?

Matt Gallant: Well, I kind of answered it like a minute ago, which is Wade and I had tried enzymes and we were blown away. So, we’re just like, “Hey.” Like, it wasn’t a sophisticated decision. It was like, we want to have our own enzymes that are the best. And with magnesium, both Wade and I were like absolutely burnt out. Like, burnt out. I couldn’t even drink a cup of coffee, it would just completely frazzle me.

And then I had felt like a sign from God. I had three people that I trusted and respected talk to me about magnesium, like within two or three weeks. And one of them said, “Hey, try combining these four magnesiums.” So, I did that, and then another guy told me, “Yeah, try really loading your body with them.” So, I did that, and within five weeks I went from burnt out to feeling absolutely zen. Like, nothing triggered me. I felt recovered. I told Wade, I said, “Try this.”

He did it. He went through the same kind of recovery. And then I’m like, “Let’s build it.” And to our credit, we did do a bit of market analysis around demand and supply, meaning how much demand was there for magnesium and how many competitors was there? And we found that, okay, there’s an opportunity here. But again, we were the first brand to do a seven-in-one mag. Now, a lot of people have copied us.

But by the way, we’re coming out with a 10-in-one with double the bioaccessibility of our current one coming soon. Very, very soon. So, one of the things we do, which I didn’t mention, is that with most of our formulas, we’ve built like four or five versions over time. That’s where the lab comes in. Like, we’ve rebuilt our enzymes five times from scratch.

Brad Weimert: Yeah. So, why not the nootropics? Because that to me is a much less crowded space. So, you say, “Hey, we have a unique formula in magnesium,” but again, back to education, I don’t fu*king know. So, I’m on Amazon looking at magnesium supplements, and there are 300. And I’m like, which– and then it comes down to marketing and who shows up and do they show up first, and what are the reviews, and all this garbage. And it has nothing to do with the efficacy of the product. So, you’re going into functionally a red ocean instead of a blue ocean.

Matt Gallant: Yep. I will say, before I answer your question about Nootopia, I’m a fan of trying to find more bluish oceans. And one of the things that we do, there’s a very nuanced thing that you’re probably not aware of. Almost every supplement in the supplement space is single ingredient, like, 80%, 90%. If you look at Thor, Life Extension, sometimes they’ll have two or three, but for all intents and purposes, it’s like one thing. And we’ve always built stacks, which that’s where the science comes in, and a lot of the experiments is like these combinations.

So, I think single ingredient formulas is a bloody red ocean because at that point, you’re just playing the cogs war. You’re competing against brands like NOW, which surprisingly, if you’re looking for good single form ingredients, their stuff is high quality. But their thing is, “We’re going to undercut everybody on price,” versus “Hey, let’s spend the time, energy, money to build something that’s superior and similar to AG1.” Okay, we’re building a stack, but everything is fully dosed. Nootopia…

Brad Weimert: Which was your nootropics company or brand.

Matt Gallant: Yes. So, all right, let’s start from the beginning. So, we acquired Mark Effinger’s business. And in my opinion, he’s the best nootropic formulator on the planet. Mark Effinger, best nootropic formula on the planet. Got introduced to him by Brad Costanzo. If you know, Brad.

Brad Weimert: I do. I don’t usually like to hang out with other Brads, but he’s a good one.

Matt Gallant: He’s a good Brad. Brad just posted on Facebook one day, and I have known Brad for a long time. He’s like, “Dude, I’ve tried everything, but this is the only nootropics that I feel.” And I just got that intuitive hit, which was a weird moment. I’m like, “I should acquire this guy.” Like, that was the first thought. Like, I hadn’t tried it. I didn’t know who owned the business. That was literally my first thought.

And Brad introduces me to Mark. I got on the phone with Mark, liked Mark, and then I spent about five grand on Mark’s stuff. I bought everything he had, like, a lot of it. And I created a spreadsheet, and every day I was trying combinations of things and different doses and single things. Like, I was relentless N-of-1 experiment. Like, every day was one or two experiments trying all the stuff. I mean, right out of the gate, I’m blown away. Like, this stuff works. I had been using nootropics for a long time, Qualia, modafinil, like Lion’s Mane. Anything that I could get my hands on, I was using, trying to find stuff that really worked. And Mark’s stuff, like, it hit harder than anything I had tried.

So, the game was, okay, how do we take Mark’s genius and package it and sell it? And anyways, after six, seven months of negotiation, we acquired him. So, my original intuitive hit, ended up being correct and rebranded to Nootopia. And one of my biggest mistakes that’s cost me the most money as a product creator has been overcomplicating things. I’ve done that with software, and I did it with Nootopia.

So, the first mistake I made was, all right, I think we had nine SKUs on launch, then we ended up adding even more, which was Mark’s original problem, which I reduced it. I probably cut out 40%, 50% of the SKUs, but it wasn’t enough. And I built an app and I built this 30-day guided journey and I’d say maybe 5%, 10% of people that got that box was able to follow that journey.

Jesse Elder was one of them. He became a real super user. But I’d send that box to really smart CEOs that I knew, and their first reaction was like, “Dude, I’m overwhelmed. I’m throwing this in the fridge, and I don’t know what to do with it.” That was like the most common feedback. And so, that was the fundamental mistake I made on the product side.

And then, this was a very dumb, dumb mistake, but we kind of pulled it into BIOptimizers. We didn’t separate it out. We didn’t separate out the numbers and we went from 0 to like 5 million a year, -ish, like run rate with Nootopia before it started falling apart. And back to the complexity, it made the advertising very– it wasn’t a good ROAS. It was very difficult to make selling the kit worked.

You know where we’re at with that business? We’re back in 2012 with BIOptimizers, like, we’re in a coma and we’re surviving. We’re still making money with it just because some people are like super fans of the products. We haven’t done any marketing. We’re about to spin it off, bring in some new people, and relaunch. So, I’d say it’ll probably relaunch by end of year with about five SKUs, not 12, which is, I think is what we ended up with. And much, again, just simpler. I think simple matters.

And on top of all that, back to the stuff we talked about earlier, people don’t understand brain chemistry. Brain chemistry’s complicated, like way more complicated than the body. Like body’s still complicated, but man, the brain is exponentially more complicated. So, when you start talking about, “Okay, you’re going to take this. It’s going to improve your acetylcholine. It’s going to help you focus. You take this, it’s a dopamine precursor. It’s going to allow your body to build more dopamine. You take this, and then it’s going to help improve your serotonin, stabilize it. And you’re going to combine this on this kind of day because you’re going to an event and you’re an introvert and you want to be an extrovert,” yeah, you’ll lose a lot of people.

But we touched on form factor earlier, and most people don’t realize, and I drank one this morning, I drank an Alani. Nootropics is massive, but the form factor is beverage. It’s canned. Monster, Red Bull, all the top players, Ghost, Alani, Celsius, basically, they’re nootropic formulas. It’s caffeine, sometimes L-theanine, taurine. Again, it has all their slightly different stacks, but it is a nootropic formula, period.

So, people don’t think of it that way. They think of it as, okay, it’s an energy drink. And now, we’re starting to see nootropic pouches, which thanks to the Zen revolution, people are familiar with that form factor. So, form factor matters. Like it’s a big deal. And we’re coming out with some mag gummies for kids because kids like gummies and it’s cute, it’s fun, it’s tasty. So, yeah, anyways, I don’t know how much you want to go deeper, but that’s the story.

Brad Weimert: No, no, that’s great. So, I’ve got two kind of massive takeaways from this, from, all of your journeys. And one is that, focusing on depth of product has been a huge key for you. And I want, again, to pull this out of supplements and say this applies to every single business that’s out there, which is V1, you have to get done. Don’t go for perfection to launch something, but V1 has to go to V2, has to go to V3. And instead of launching new product, new product, new product, it’s launched V2, V3, V4, V5 and make the product excellent.

Matt Gallant: I think V1 is the– in 2026, it needs to be minimum viable.

Brad Weimert: Love that.

Matt Gallant: I think, launching minimum viable where, okay, the utility is there, but it’s a bad customer experience, it’s a bad user experience.

Brad Weimert: Yeah, that’s a good idea. I like that term, minimum lovable product, which ironically is what Lovable the company talks about. Maybe not ironically. It makes total sense, but anyway, what we talk about internally is that at Easy Pay Direct is V1 is not a sh*tty version of the final product. It’s an amazing tremendously scaled down version of the final product. And Apple is phenomenal at this. They routinely launch new products that lack features and functionality, but what’s there is flawless.

Matt Gallant: And Elon’s big on that, too. Like, his whole thing is let’s strip out as many features as possible down to the point where it might almost break the product, and if it does break the product, okay, let’s add them back in. And then you scale.

Brad Weimert: Actually, his language is, “If we don’t have to add something back in, we didn’t strip it down enough in the first place.” The other thing that you said that I think is tremendously relevant to everybody and people might not bridge this gap, but you talk about form factor. And you were talking about specifically beverages to deliver, and then pouches because people are accustomed to it.

The thing that I think is important in any other business model is meeting consumers where they are. And so, if you’re trying to recondition their behavior, it’s going to be very difficult. And if you can meet them where they are, i.e., they’re used to getting energy and focus from a beverage, or inside of the client journey or user journey of a software product, think about what they normally do. And so, there is a time and a place to say, “Hey, there’s this new better way to do it,” but you have to bridge that gap somehow, and if you try to just drop a brand-new way to do something, you better bridge the gap because everybody’s already conditioned to do something a certain way.

Matt Gallant: Yeah, when I think about Dave Asprey’s success, like when he came on the scene, he took something that the majority of people do on a daily basis, which was drink coffee, and then, okay, just add this to it to build a super coffee. Like, it wasn’t, “Okay, do this new ritual.” It’s just enhance your existing ritual. So, that’s very powerful. To me, like when I analyze why that broke through the way it did, that was the reason. Again, it wasn’t a new thing. It was just add this to your existing routine.

Brad Weimert: Yeah, that’s amazing. What advice do you have for brand new entrepreneurs starting out?

Matt Gallant: I think you need to be constantly building skills. Like, skill stacking is the game, and there’s never been a better time to be a generalist. It’s never been easier to be a generalist because now, and I’ll use like a real-world example, we’re doing a bunch of renos in my place, and I wanted to know what the best painting and flooring process was. Like, again, things I don’t know much about, although my first real business was a painting company when I was 19, College Pro Painters, which was baptism by fire.

Anyways, but I went to Claude and Gemini, and it just gave me the best process. So, I went from not knowing a single thing to getting the gold standard process, the name of the products I need to use, the steps that we needed to do, and I just gave that to the contractors and said, “Implement this,” and they did. And that’s true, like every function in the business, more or less, if you can go to AI and get a gold or a silver level process or blueprint for almost anything. And the question is like, yeah, what’s the top skills today that people need to learn? I mean, I don’t think marketing’s going anywhere.

Like, we’re building a ton of AI marketing tools internally that is going to reduce the head count and multiply the output. But the value of someone that is very skilled in design, copy, or marketing has never been higher because AI has no taste. AI cannot curate. AI cannot input a vision. You have to input the vision into AI, and then it will process that based on your instructions, and then technically, you can get an infinite number of images, and then you need somebody skilled that can look at a thousand images and pick the 10 or the 20 or the 100 that will convert the best.

So, I still think that becoming knowledgeable and becoming a master, I think the value of mastery in 2026 has never been higher. So, I think you’re going to see, there’s a lot of noise and fear-mongering around AI replacing people. And that’s going to happen to some degree, and it’s going to happen primarily with unskilled positions – data entry, copy-pasting information, like that’s going to get replaced. But you still need great marketers and great masters to drive these machines no matter how powerful they get.

Brad Weimert: Yeah. I would argue that. I think that’s great advice for brand-new entrepreneurs, and I would argue that it’s great advice for any human at all right now, which is you better protect some portion of your daily time to be learning the new tools and learning new skills.

Matt Gallant: Yeah. Yeah, I think definitely becoming proficient in AI is mandatory. Like, it’s not an option. It would be like not knowing how to type, not knowing how to use a computer. Like, it’s that level of fundamental, utility, and power. But again, I’m biased when I say this, but marketing and product creation to me is the core of the game. And every industry, every type of market, the process of becoming a master in those categories changes a little bit, but I think we covered most of the fundamentals.

Brad Weimert: I love it.

Matt Gallant: Like, becoming obsessed with going deep, being obsessed with giving value, being obsessed with being the best. I don’t think you can lose. Like, people, there’s always a market for the best. I mean, you look at these high-end markets, whether it’s the Michelin star, the three-star Michelin star places that cost $1,000 a head or the best cars, the hypercars, just always, always room at the top.

Brad Weimert: Matt Gallant, where can people find out more about you, man?

Matt Gallant: Yeah, I’m kind of a wizard behind the scene type of guy. I say that because I’m not that active on social media. But you can find me @mattgallant on Instagram, probably the place I’m the most active. And I have a blog, which I haven’t posted in a long time, but there’s some good content there. I think it’s MattGallant.TV. There’s a free book on productivity I give away there. It’s 3X Your Productivity, which a lot of people have gotten a lot of value. I just give it for free. It’s like 82 pages, and there’s no fluff.

And yeah, we’ve also created some really good books within BIOptimizers, so From Sick to Superhuman, and if you’re interested in nutrition, we wrote a 500-page reference manual basically called The Ultimate Nutrition Bible. Took us three years to write that. I think it’s the most comprehensive book on nutrition and the most unbiased. Like, we really just wanted to reduce the dogma that exists in nutrition.

Brad Weimert: Amazing, man. I appreciate you taking time to talk.

Matt Gallant: Thank you. Been awesome.